Some have suggested that land use issues are simply means to express fear of prisons in a more acceptable manner. They have dismissed complaints about procedural problems in the county’s proposal for a location of the re-entry facility. However, from my perspective, those dismissals fail to understand the magnitude of the impact of this facility on a place like the city of Davis. There has been little to no discussion to this point as to who is expected to provide the vital services for a location such as the county airport.
These are not merely academic exercises, the county for example lacks its own fire department. There are questions about roadways, water, sewer, power, and the like that could have impacts on adjacent jurisdictions such as the city of Davis. These potential impacts should necessitate cooperation and at the very least the common courtesy of advanced notice. Yet, it is clear that this did not occur.
County Supervisor Matt Rexroad has suggested that while “the County certainly could have done a better job in communicating with the people of Yolo County regarding this issue” however, he does not believe he is personally taking a hit for poor communications.
I would tend to agree with Mr. Rexroad here, he personally is not the problem with regards to communications.
“When this issue came up I personally spoke to three members of the Woodland City Council within a few hours on learning more. Later I spoke to a fourth. I personally called the Police Chief and City Manager. Long discussions were involved with all of these people.
I communicated with the city leaders in Woodland and continue to do that on a regular basis. Lately I have not talked much with Martie Dote but I need to do that more. I talked Flory more when he was on the Council. In fact, several times I talked to Art and Dave more when they were both on the City Council in one day than my predecessor talked to me in the entire four years he was in office.
I am hesitant to communicate with the people outside of Woodland on county policy issues. On this blog I lay out my positions on issues and lots of people read them.
You can rip me for a whole host of things….. but lack of communications in not one of them.”
However, as Mr. Rexroad points out, it is not his responsibility to communicate to the residents of other districts within the county–and whether it is Duane Chamberlain who represents the rural areas where the proposed facility would be placed, or the city of Davis’ representatives Helen Thomson and Mariko Yamada, there has been a fundamental lack of communication between the county and the city, and this is not the first time this has arisen.
I do disagree with Supervisor Rexroad on one point, during a phone conversation he suggested that this location was not within an area that Davis should have any say over. I firmly disagree on that point, I think that the impacts on Davis are rather direct and there needed to be earlier discussions on the possibility of locating the facility on this site.
During a phone conversation with Davis City Councilmember Lamar Heystek, the councilmember expressed strong concern over the proposed project location.
“The proposed project is located in the Davis planning area, it would have a Davis address. And the occupants of the facility would be released into our community. So yes, I have very strong concerns.”
At the same time, the councilmember told me that he and the city received “little” or no communication from the county on this issue.
“I had actually heard from neighbors of the area, outside the city limits, before I had heard anything from city staff or the county. That leads me to believe that our city staff was not kept abreast of the plan to propose this site and it leads me to believe that our inclusion in the process was not considered from the beginning.”
He continued:
“We want to maintain a positive relationship with our counterparts in the county. We have already learned from the lessons of the northwest quadrant that the city of Davis has a very strong interest in protecting interests not only within our boundaries but also within areas of our county where we have a clear say on, per agreement and per conventional planning principals.
It troubles me that we were not involved at an earlier stage in a meaningful way.”
Furthermore, he made the case that the interests of the city extend beyond the geographical boundaries that separate city jurisdictions from the county. These interlocking and overlapping interests have necessitated the creation of bodies such as the city-county two-by-two, but also regional bodies like SACOG and LAFCO to bring together jurisdictions in an effort to forge cooperative relations.
“Much is made about the fact that the city of Davis has a sphere of influence and there’s land within our planning area, we as decisionmakers who represent the people of this city have a very solemn responsibility not only to represent the interests of the people who lie within our city limits but also a responsibility to represent the interests of those people even as they lay outside of the city limits. That means that extrinsically our residents have interests that do not lie solely within the city’s boundaries. Those interests also exceed those boundaries. So it’s our interest and responsibility as councilmembers and as city officials to look very closely at this proposal to ask for and to frankly demand attention and involvement in any process that the county may be undertaking.”
Along with the lack of communication, are a variety of reasons why the county needed to involve the city in discussions from the start. It is unclear whether the facility will require access to the Davis system of sewer or water. Supervisor Matt Rexroad believes that wells can provide the cite with water, but what about sewer?
From the city’s perspective, any need from the county would tax a system that is already in the process of requiring major capital improvements.
Councilmember Heystek said:
“Our infrastructure has already been so taxed that we barely can afford to serve our existing residents and our existing ratepayers. So adding new service to our water and sewer systems is very questionable. I’m not sure if this facility proposes to tap into the city’s water and sewer systems. But, if that’s the case, it would be unconscionable for any plan to move very much forward without any meaningful city involvement.”
In addition to the issue of water and sewer, fire service is a concern. The airport has a volunteer fire department that houses two volunteer fire fighters. Such a facility could quickly move beyond the capabilities of that small department to provide emergency services. The county does not have its own fire department. So who would have responsibility to serve the new facility in the case of an emergency?
That answer is unclear to Councilmember Heystek:
“I would like to know whether we are indeed obligated to engage in a contract for services if it’s not feasible or otherwise in the city’s best interest to do so.”
What is clear is that such a facility could tax the city already strapped for resources.
“We have talked about five minutes response time issues that the department has brought up and the city has studied. The issue of simultaneous calls has been studied by the department and the council as a whole. Adding more territory to serve clearly doesn’t make sense at this time when we are considering how we serve our existing service areas.”
The traffic issue was a big concern to local residents on Thursday night. Some have speculated that this is a huge potential problem, others have kind of discounted that problem. Councilmember Heystek pointed out that there has not been any kind of traffic study to date, so it would be difficult to assess potential problems.
“None of us can answer that question specifically since we don’t have a traffic study before us. But an EIR for this project, I assume one will be carried out, an EIR with a traffic study would reveal an answer for that.”
However, the potential problem of the taxing of existing infrastructure is a big concern to Mr. Heystek.
“You raise a very good point, to what extent will incorporated cities infrastructure be taxed in that respect. You already asked about water and sewer, you’ve asked about the fire department, and you’ve asked about the roads, clearly these accumulated infrastructure service impacts drastically effects the way we serve our residents. And so hopefully dialogue between the county and city will be meaningful, productive, full, and comprehensive. I hope that any discussion recognizes and honors the fact that the city has a legal right to participate in the discussion and the process as a whole.”
For the Councilmember the problem comes back to communication and shared interests.
“We have two representatives on the city-county two-by-two–actually we have four Davis representatives. I hope that the four Davisites will not only insure that county interests are served but also city interests. And while those interests often overlap, they are not mutually inclusive, that is they don’t always overlap perfectly. So it will be interesting to see how the dynamic at that level plays out. I assume that there will be other ways for the city council or board of supervisors to be involved. I will exercise my right to voice an opinion to cast as necessary.”
The problem that I have is that this discussion is coming up again. Just last year, the city expressed concerns about lack of discussion prior to the general plan process by the county. The city was caught off-guard at that time about proposed developments on the periphery of Davis. Everyone had suggested that we would learn from those acrimonious discussions that exploded into full-blown controversy, but it seems like we have not.
On Tuesday, the county will formally take up the proposal and will recommend study at the three sites that have been proposed. This fulfills their obligation to recommend three sites for possible locations for the re-entry facility. It appears that the state would then study the sites and that sometime down the line, a decision would be made by the county as to where to place the facility.
The staff recommendation is as follows:
“RECOMMENDED ACTION:
A. Reaffirm the county’s support for the siting of a reentry facility in Yolo County;
B. Approve the list of potential sites for a state reentry facility in Yolo County;
a) County Road 90 and State Route 16 (east of Madison)
b) County Road 86a and State Route 16 (southeast of Esparto)
c) Yolo County Airport
C. Authorize the signing of the Reentry Program Facility Siting Agreement between the California Department of Corrections and Rehabilitation (CDCR) and the county for potential reentry facility sites and to comply with Assembly Bill (AB 900);
D. Authorize the signing of Options to Purchase real estate agreements for County Road 90 at State Route 16 (KATHYANNA RANCH, LLC) and County Road 86a at State Route 16 (JOHN DETERDING CO.) for potential sites for a reentry facility.”
So no final determination appears in the works for Tuesday. However, we are still left with burning questions about the process. For example, when should the county notify cities about plans that will impact the city and possibly involve city infrastructure or at the very least are adjacent to the cities? Moreover, we know that Brown Act requirements for public notification are extremely low, even placement in the newspaper is somewhat problematic. The city of Davis has community meetings well in advance of new housing projects–why not a similar approach from the county?
People have suggested that these changes would not change people’s minds on the subject of prison construction. They are probably correct. But process is an end in and of itself, it is not merely a means to achieve consensus or agreement, although those are worthwhile goals. Proper procedures in this case would not diminish outcry. However, what they might do is allow other jurisdictions to address some of the concerns of residents in advance. They also might have allowed the county to determine early on potential problems at the proposed sites that would have eliminated them well before they panicked the public. All of these things need to change. We live in an information age, and Davis’ two supervisors have not sufficiently communicated with their constituents on this issue.
All of these things are correctable in the future if there is an effort to proactively involve citizens in the process.
—Doug Paul Davis reporting
“It is unclear whether the facility will require access to the Davis system of sewer or water.”
How could it? It’s too far away to tap into either. So it would have to be on well water and septic.
“It is unclear whether the facility will require access to the Davis system of sewer or water.”
How could it? It’s too far away to tap into either. So it would have to be on well water and septic.
“It is unclear whether the facility will require access to the Davis system of sewer or water.”
How could it? It’s too far away to tap into either. So it would have to be on well water and septic.
“It is unclear whether the facility will require access to the Davis system of sewer or water.”
How could it? It’s too far away to tap into either. So it would have to be on well water and septic.
Another good article DPD. Communication is needed, but so is common sense. Hopefully Councilman Heystek will come on this blog today, because the questions he asks deserve to be heard and discussed.
My personal opinion is, and I could easily be wrong, that the chances of this facility tapping into the City water and sewer systems is somewhere between extremely slim and none. The distance from the nearest connection is so far that the costs of both pipes and pumps would be huge. I suspect that the cost of drilling a well onsite and providing onsite septic would be less thant the capital cost of the connections without even considering the ongoing annual operational costs.
So bottom-line I don’t think that water and sewer are a concern for Davis, but I could be wrong.
Another good article DPD. Communication is needed, but so is common sense. Hopefully Councilman Heystek will come on this blog today, because the questions he asks deserve to be heard and discussed.
My personal opinion is, and I could easily be wrong, that the chances of this facility tapping into the City water and sewer systems is somewhere between extremely slim and none. The distance from the nearest connection is so far that the costs of both pipes and pumps would be huge. I suspect that the cost of drilling a well onsite and providing onsite septic would be less thant the capital cost of the connections without even considering the ongoing annual operational costs.
So bottom-line I don’t think that water and sewer are a concern for Davis, but I could be wrong.
Another good article DPD. Communication is needed, but so is common sense. Hopefully Councilman Heystek will come on this blog today, because the questions he asks deserve to be heard and discussed.
My personal opinion is, and I could easily be wrong, that the chances of this facility tapping into the City water and sewer systems is somewhere between extremely slim and none. The distance from the nearest connection is so far that the costs of both pipes and pumps would be huge. I suspect that the cost of drilling a well onsite and providing onsite septic would be less thant the capital cost of the connections without even considering the ongoing annual operational costs.
So bottom-line I don’t think that water and sewer are a concern for Davis, but I could be wrong.
Another good article DPD. Communication is needed, but so is common sense. Hopefully Councilman Heystek will come on this blog today, because the questions he asks deserve to be heard and discussed.
My personal opinion is, and I could easily be wrong, that the chances of this facility tapping into the City water and sewer systems is somewhere between extremely slim and none. The distance from the nearest connection is so far that the costs of both pipes and pumps would be huge. I suspect that the cost of drilling a well onsite and providing onsite septic would be less thant the capital cost of the connections without even considering the ongoing annual operational costs.
So bottom-line I don’t think that water and sewer are a concern for Davis, but I could be wrong.
I think it’s a good point that water and sewer is probably not an issue, but it is worth discussing with the city. Emergency services and roads are an issue that would need to be resolved.
I think it’s a good point that water and sewer is probably not an issue, but it is worth discussing with the city. Emergency services and roads are an issue that would need to be resolved.
I think it’s a good point that water and sewer is probably not an issue, but it is worth discussing with the city. Emergency services and roads are an issue that would need to be resolved.
I think it’s a good point that water and sewer is probably not an issue, but it is worth discussing with the city. Emergency services and roads are an issue that would need to be resolved.
The issue of “…poor communication” in this case, is actually one of trust between those who govern and those who are governed. An unduly short advance notice of a public meeting may be viewed by some as a thinly veiled attempt to deprive the public of input while providing “deniability” of that intent for the governing entities. If local government’s intent is to foster a spirit of cooperation and respect,with and for the public, they wouldn’t be systematically engaging in this tactic.
The issue of “…poor communication” in this case, is actually one of trust between those who govern and those who are governed. An unduly short advance notice of a public meeting may be viewed by some as a thinly veiled attempt to deprive the public of input while providing “deniability” of that intent for the governing entities. If local government’s intent is to foster a spirit of cooperation and respect,with and for the public, they wouldn’t be systematically engaging in this tactic.
The issue of “…poor communication” in this case, is actually one of trust between those who govern and those who are governed. An unduly short advance notice of a public meeting may be viewed by some as a thinly veiled attempt to deprive the public of input while providing “deniability” of that intent for the governing entities. If local government’s intent is to foster a spirit of cooperation and respect,with and for the public, they wouldn’t be systematically engaging in this tactic.
The issue of “…poor communication” in this case, is actually one of trust between those who govern and those who are governed. An unduly short advance notice of a public meeting may be viewed by some as a thinly veiled attempt to deprive the public of input while providing “deniability” of that intent for the governing entities. If local government’s intent is to foster a spirit of cooperation and respect,with and for the public, they wouldn’t be systematically engaging in this tactic.
DPD:
If the City of Davis is correct in this case don’t they have to be opposed or concerned with every single expansion of services at UC Davis as well?
It would be much closer and tax the infrastructure much more.
Matt
DPD:
If the City of Davis is correct in this case don’t they have to be opposed or concerned with every single expansion of services at UC Davis as well?
It would be much closer and tax the infrastructure much more.
Matt
DPD:
If the City of Davis is correct in this case don’t they have to be opposed or concerned with every single expansion of services at UC Davis as well?
It would be much closer and tax the infrastructure much more.
Matt
DPD:
If the City of Davis is correct in this case don’t they have to be opposed or concerned with every single expansion of services at UC Davis as well?
It would be much closer and tax the infrastructure much more.
Matt
Matt:
I think they are concerned about such things, that is why there is talk and discussion pertaining to the West Village Project and possible annexation. Whether they oppose them or not is another question.
Matt:
I think they are concerned about such things, that is why there is talk and discussion pertaining to the West Village Project and possible annexation. Whether they oppose them or not is another question.
Matt:
I think they are concerned about such things, that is why there is talk and discussion pertaining to the West Village Project and possible annexation. Whether they oppose them or not is another question.
Matt:
I think they are concerned about such things, that is why there is talk and discussion pertaining to the West Village Project and possible annexation. Whether they oppose them or not is another question.
matt rexroad: “If the City of Davis is correct in this case don’t they have to be opposed or concerned with every single expansion of services at UC Davis as well?”
Certainly they can be concerned with UC Davis expansion projects, but they can’t do anything to stop them. There is a long history of poor communication between the university and the city.
matt rexroad: “If the City of Davis is correct in this case don’t they have to be opposed or concerned with every single expansion of services at UC Davis as well?”
Certainly they can be concerned with UC Davis expansion projects, but they can’t do anything to stop them. There is a long history of poor communication between the university and the city.
matt rexroad: “If the City of Davis is correct in this case don’t they have to be opposed or concerned with every single expansion of services at UC Davis as well?”
Certainly they can be concerned with UC Davis expansion projects, but they can’t do anything to stop them. There is a long history of poor communication between the university and the city.
matt rexroad: “If the City of Davis is correct in this case don’t they have to be opposed or concerned with every single expansion of services at UC Davis as well?”
Certainly they can be concerned with UC Davis expansion projects, but they can’t do anything to stop them. There is a long history of poor communication between the university and the city.
Hi Matt,
What guarantee exits, in the agreements with Corrections, that if this thing is out in rural areas of the county it won’t morph into a maximum security prison or some other type of corrections facility?
Hi Matt,
What guarantee exits, in the agreements with Corrections, that if this thing is out in rural areas of the county it won’t morph into a maximum security prison or some other type of corrections facility?
Hi Matt,
What guarantee exits, in the agreements with Corrections, that if this thing is out in rural areas of the county it won’t morph into a maximum security prison or some other type of corrections facility?
Hi Matt,
What guarantee exits, in the agreements with Corrections, that if this thing is out in rural areas of the county it won’t morph into a maximum security prison or some other type of corrections facility?
I think the Fire safety issue alone should kill the site near the Yolo AIrport.
The Davis City Fire Dept has contracts to handle fire safety and response issues outside of the city’s borders. For example, No Mans Land, which is east and south of El Macero. (I dont remember, but I think the city handles fire in the NW Quadrant, too.)
If the reentry facility goes into the Yolo Airport area, I think it will require a Davis 4th Fire Station to handle calls north of Covell Blvd. Other than the proposed less than 100 homes on the horse ranch site, any larger project north of Covell needs the 4th fire station.
(Hey, Lewis Homes/Hunt Wesson Site, I know your two local reps read this. Where is your funding for the 4th fire station? It’s all yours, as your project is the tipping point. Not a dime should come from existing residents, not one.)
I think the Fire safety issue alone should kill the site near the Yolo AIrport.
The Davis City Fire Dept has contracts to handle fire safety and response issues outside of the city’s borders. For example, No Mans Land, which is east and south of El Macero. (I dont remember, but I think the city handles fire in the NW Quadrant, too.)
If the reentry facility goes into the Yolo Airport area, I think it will require a Davis 4th Fire Station to handle calls north of Covell Blvd. Other than the proposed less than 100 homes on the horse ranch site, any larger project north of Covell needs the 4th fire station.
(Hey, Lewis Homes/Hunt Wesson Site, I know your two local reps read this. Where is your funding for the 4th fire station? It’s all yours, as your project is the tipping point. Not a dime should come from existing residents, not one.)
I think the Fire safety issue alone should kill the site near the Yolo AIrport.
The Davis City Fire Dept has contracts to handle fire safety and response issues outside of the city’s borders. For example, No Mans Land, which is east and south of El Macero. (I dont remember, but I think the city handles fire in the NW Quadrant, too.)
If the reentry facility goes into the Yolo Airport area, I think it will require a Davis 4th Fire Station to handle calls north of Covell Blvd. Other than the proposed less than 100 homes on the horse ranch site, any larger project north of Covell needs the 4th fire station.
(Hey, Lewis Homes/Hunt Wesson Site, I know your two local reps read this. Where is your funding for the 4th fire station? It’s all yours, as your project is the tipping point. Not a dime should come from existing residents, not one.)
I think the Fire safety issue alone should kill the site near the Yolo AIrport.
The Davis City Fire Dept has contracts to handle fire safety and response issues outside of the city’s borders. For example, No Mans Land, which is east and south of El Macero. (I dont remember, but I think the city handles fire in the NW Quadrant, too.)
If the reentry facility goes into the Yolo Airport area, I think it will require a Davis 4th Fire Station to handle calls north of Covell Blvd. Other than the proposed less than 100 homes on the horse ranch site, any larger project north of Covell needs the 4th fire station.
(Hey, Lewis Homes/Hunt Wesson Site, I know your two local reps read this. Where is your funding for the 4th fire station? It’s all yours, as your project is the tipping point. Not a dime should come from existing residents, not one.)
“The Davis City Fire Dept has contracts to handle fire safety and response issues outside of the city’s borders. For example, No Mans Land, which is east and south of El Macero.”
Does anyone happen to know any details about the fire which burned (sometime between Tuesday morning and Thursday morning this past week) the northern portion of the Yolo Grasslands Regional Park east of Road 104 (Mace Blvd)? I biked by there on Tuesday and it was full of tall brown grass. On Thursday it was obviously all burned up, over a very large area (I would guess >100 acres). I didn't see anything in the paper about this fire. I know that a lot of Davis people, who planted oak trees out there a decade ago, were worried that if the fire department set that grass on fire, it would kill the oaks. Based on what I could see, it looks like the small oaks came through the fire fine, as did the big county sign at the front of the park.
“If the reentry facility goes into the Yolo Airport area, I think it will require a Davis 4th Fire Station…”
Huh? There is a fire station right at the airport right now.
In terms of fighting fires, we have ABSOLUTELY NO NEED IN DAVIS FOR A FOURTH FIRE STATION — THIS IS A HUGE RUSE PUT ON US BY THE FIRE FIGHTERS UNION AND ITS SHILLS.
In terms of medical response, the county is part of a joint powers authority with 6 other counties in contract with AMR. Under that agreement, Davis gets 2 full-time ambulances in town 24 hours a day*, 365 days a year. If a new facility on Road 95 somehow impacts our need for ambulance services, the county can address that within the JPA. Currently, the response times for medical emergencies in Davis are quicker than our regional average.
* On top of that, because there are 3 full time ambulances in West Sac and 3 more in Woodland, if Davis has a surfeit of calls, AMR repositions ambulances on our periphery as a back up.
“The Davis City Fire Dept has contracts to handle fire safety and response issues outside of the city’s borders. For example, No Mans Land, which is east and south of El Macero.”
Does anyone happen to know any details about the fire which burned (sometime between Tuesday morning and Thursday morning this past week) the northern portion of the Yolo Grasslands Regional Park east of Road 104 (Mace Blvd)? I biked by there on Tuesday and it was full of tall brown grass. On Thursday it was obviously all burned up, over a very large area (I would guess >100 acres). I didn't see anything in the paper about this fire. I know that a lot of Davis people, who planted oak trees out there a decade ago, were worried that if the fire department set that grass on fire, it would kill the oaks. Based on what I could see, it looks like the small oaks came through the fire fine, as did the big county sign at the front of the park.
“If the reentry facility goes into the Yolo Airport area, I think it will require a Davis 4th Fire Station…”
Huh? There is a fire station right at the airport right now.
In terms of fighting fires, we have ABSOLUTELY NO NEED IN DAVIS FOR A FOURTH FIRE STATION — THIS IS A HUGE RUSE PUT ON US BY THE FIRE FIGHTERS UNION AND ITS SHILLS.
In terms of medical response, the county is part of a joint powers authority with 6 other counties in contract with AMR. Under that agreement, Davis gets 2 full-time ambulances in town 24 hours a day*, 365 days a year. If a new facility on Road 95 somehow impacts our need for ambulance services, the county can address that within the JPA. Currently, the response times for medical emergencies in Davis are quicker than our regional average.
* On top of that, because there are 3 full time ambulances in West Sac and 3 more in Woodland, if Davis has a surfeit of calls, AMR repositions ambulances on our periphery as a back up.
“The Davis City Fire Dept has contracts to handle fire safety and response issues outside of the city’s borders. For example, No Mans Land, which is east and south of El Macero.”
Does anyone happen to know any details about the fire which burned (sometime between Tuesday morning and Thursday morning this past week) the northern portion of the Yolo Grasslands Regional Park east of Road 104 (Mace Blvd)? I biked by there on Tuesday and it was full of tall brown grass. On Thursday it was obviously all burned up, over a very large area (I would guess >100 acres). I didn't see anything in the paper about this fire. I know that a lot of Davis people, who planted oak trees out there a decade ago, were worried that if the fire department set that grass on fire, it would kill the oaks. Based on what I could see, it looks like the small oaks came through the fire fine, as did the big county sign at the front of the park.
“If the reentry facility goes into the Yolo Airport area, I think it will require a Davis 4th Fire Station…”
Huh? There is a fire station right at the airport right now.
In terms of fighting fires, we have ABSOLUTELY NO NEED IN DAVIS FOR A FOURTH FIRE STATION — THIS IS A HUGE RUSE PUT ON US BY THE FIRE FIGHTERS UNION AND ITS SHILLS.
In terms of medical response, the county is part of a joint powers authority with 6 other counties in contract with AMR. Under that agreement, Davis gets 2 full-time ambulances in town 24 hours a day*, 365 days a year. If a new facility on Road 95 somehow impacts our need for ambulance services, the county can address that within the JPA. Currently, the response times for medical emergencies in Davis are quicker than our regional average.
* On top of that, because there are 3 full time ambulances in West Sac and 3 more in Woodland, if Davis has a surfeit of calls, AMR repositions ambulances on our periphery as a back up.
“The Davis City Fire Dept has contracts to handle fire safety and response issues outside of the city’s borders. For example, No Mans Land, which is east and south of El Macero.”
Does anyone happen to know any details about the fire which burned (sometime between Tuesday morning and Thursday morning this past week) the northern portion of the Yolo Grasslands Regional Park east of Road 104 (Mace Blvd)? I biked by there on Tuesday and it was full of tall brown grass. On Thursday it was obviously all burned up, over a very large area (I would guess >100 acres). I didn't see anything in the paper about this fire. I know that a lot of Davis people, who planted oak trees out there a decade ago, were worried that if the fire department set that grass on fire, it would kill the oaks. Based on what I could see, it looks like the small oaks came through the fire fine, as did the big county sign at the front of the park.
“If the reentry facility goes into the Yolo Airport area, I think it will require a Davis 4th Fire Station…”
Huh? There is a fire station right at the airport right now.
In terms of fighting fires, we have ABSOLUTELY NO NEED IN DAVIS FOR A FOURTH FIRE STATION — THIS IS A HUGE RUSE PUT ON US BY THE FIRE FIGHTERS UNION AND ITS SHILLS.
In terms of medical response, the county is part of a joint powers authority with 6 other counties in contract with AMR. Under that agreement, Davis gets 2 full-time ambulances in town 24 hours a day*, 365 days a year. If a new facility on Road 95 somehow impacts our need for ambulance services, the county can address that within the JPA. Currently, the response times for medical emergencies in Davis are quicker than our regional average.
* On top of that, because there are 3 full time ambulances in West Sac and 3 more in Woodland, if Davis has a surfeit of calls, AMR repositions ambulances on our periphery as a back up.
Rich,
The Yolo Airport fire station is not large enough to handle the job.
As for the 4th Fire Station, ANY major new development north of Covell that is in the David area requires a fourth fire station. It is not a ruse by the fire fighters. The response times north of Covell are poor at best, due to the distance and volume of calls.
I think the City should provide some sort of medical-only response program, especially north of Covell. Maybe a medical facility/station would help. But until someone shows me that a new medical response program will work, I have to take the position that Lewis Homes, Covell Village, Northwest Quadrant, or the reentry facility at Yolo Airport, simply has to pay for the 4th fire station.
Rich,
The Yolo Airport fire station is not large enough to handle the job.
As for the 4th Fire Station, ANY major new development north of Covell that is in the David area requires a fourth fire station. It is not a ruse by the fire fighters. The response times north of Covell are poor at best, due to the distance and volume of calls.
I think the City should provide some sort of medical-only response program, especially north of Covell. Maybe a medical facility/station would help. But until someone shows me that a new medical response program will work, I have to take the position that Lewis Homes, Covell Village, Northwest Quadrant, or the reentry facility at Yolo Airport, simply has to pay for the 4th fire station.
Rich,
The Yolo Airport fire station is not large enough to handle the job.
As for the 4th Fire Station, ANY major new development north of Covell that is in the David area requires a fourth fire station. It is not a ruse by the fire fighters. The response times north of Covell are poor at best, due to the distance and volume of calls.
I think the City should provide some sort of medical-only response program, especially north of Covell. Maybe a medical facility/station would help. But until someone shows me that a new medical response program will work, I have to take the position that Lewis Homes, Covell Village, Northwest Quadrant, or the reentry facility at Yolo Airport, simply has to pay for the 4th fire station.
Rich,
The Yolo Airport fire station is not large enough to handle the job.
As for the 4th Fire Station, ANY major new development north of Covell that is in the David area requires a fourth fire station. It is not a ruse by the fire fighters. The response times north of Covell are poor at best, due to the distance and volume of calls.
I think the City should provide some sort of medical-only response program, especially north of Covell. Maybe a medical facility/station would help. But until someone shows me that a new medical response program will work, I have to take the position that Lewis Homes, Covell Village, Northwest Quadrant, or the reentry facility at Yolo Airport, simply has to pay for the 4th fire station.
Black Bart:
There is no way to say that the state will not expand this proposed re-entry facility.
There is also no way to say that they will not simply buy/seize Covell Village and put a prison there either.
The state can do an unlimited number of things. In the cases that have been pointed out where the state has expanded existing facilities they have started with more land than they needed.
In this case they are just shopping for 15 acres.
Matt
Black Bart:
There is no way to say that the state will not expand this proposed re-entry facility.
There is also no way to say that they will not simply buy/seize Covell Village and put a prison there either.
The state can do an unlimited number of things. In the cases that have been pointed out where the state has expanded existing facilities they have started with more land than they needed.
In this case they are just shopping for 15 acres.
Matt
Black Bart:
There is no way to say that the state will not expand this proposed re-entry facility.
There is also no way to say that they will not simply buy/seize Covell Village and put a prison there either.
The state can do an unlimited number of things. In the cases that have been pointed out where the state has expanded existing facilities they have started with more land than they needed.
In this case they are just shopping for 15 acres.
Matt
Black Bart:
There is no way to say that the state will not expand this proposed re-entry facility.
There is also no way to say that they will not simply buy/seize Covell Village and put a prison there either.
The state can do an unlimited number of things. In the cases that have been pointed out where the state has expanded existing facilities they have started with more land than they needed.
In this case they are just shopping for 15 acres.
Matt
“If the City of Davis is correct in this case don’t they have to be opposed or concerned with every single expansion of services at UC Davis as well?”
The situation is different because UC Davis has it’s own Fire and Police services, and UC Davis has it’s own waste water treatment plant (for both residential and industrial waste). However, you are correct in that the City of Davis continues to be concerned about UCD expansion because often the new growth requires joint Davis/UCD fire and police agreements, in order to defer costs for University developments inside the city (a good example is the Cuarto dorms, and what is happening with West Village).
The difference between UCD expansion and the re-entry facility is that UCD can help offer services and mitigate costs without huge additional costs to itself.
-M.
“If the City of Davis is correct in this case don’t they have to be opposed or concerned with every single expansion of services at UC Davis as well?”
The situation is different because UC Davis has it’s own Fire and Police services, and UC Davis has it’s own waste water treatment plant (for both residential and industrial waste). However, you are correct in that the City of Davis continues to be concerned about UCD expansion because often the new growth requires joint Davis/UCD fire and police agreements, in order to defer costs for University developments inside the city (a good example is the Cuarto dorms, and what is happening with West Village).
The difference between UCD expansion and the re-entry facility is that UCD can help offer services and mitigate costs without huge additional costs to itself.
-M.
“If the City of Davis is correct in this case don’t they have to be opposed or concerned with every single expansion of services at UC Davis as well?”
The situation is different because UC Davis has it’s own Fire and Police services, and UC Davis has it’s own waste water treatment plant (for both residential and industrial waste). However, you are correct in that the City of Davis continues to be concerned about UCD expansion because often the new growth requires joint Davis/UCD fire and police agreements, in order to defer costs for University developments inside the city (a good example is the Cuarto dorms, and what is happening with West Village).
The difference between UCD expansion and the re-entry facility is that UCD can help offer services and mitigate costs without huge additional costs to itself.
-M.
“If the City of Davis is correct in this case don’t they have to be opposed or concerned with every single expansion of services at UC Davis as well?”
The situation is different because UC Davis has it’s own Fire and Police services, and UC Davis has it’s own waste water treatment plant (for both residential and industrial waste). However, you are correct in that the City of Davis continues to be concerned about UCD expansion because often the new growth requires joint Davis/UCD fire and police agreements, in order to defer costs for University developments inside the city (a good example is the Cuarto dorms, and what is happening with West Village).
The difference between UCD expansion and the re-entry facility is that UCD can help offer services and mitigate costs without huge additional costs to itself.
-M.
LACK OF COMMUNICATION FROM GOV’T = ATTEMPTS TO CUT OFF PUBLIC INPUT
We see this play out at the county level and the Davis City Council level repeatedly. It is nothing more than a political tactic to create “plausible deniability”. If politicians have nothing to hide, then they should be willing to take whatever heat comes from public comment, as well as listen with an open mind. But more often than not, politicians don’t want public input, bc their minds are already made up from hidden agendas. In the case of the Bd of Sups, they want a “free” $30 million dollars of state funding.
However, nothing in life is ever truly “free”. There is always a price to pay. As Matt Rexroad has admitted, the reentry facility could easily morph into a regular prison. He has stated he didn’t think Davis needed to be consulted. Funny, the citizens of Woodland don’t want the reentry facility in their backyard, and I don’t blame them. Neither do we. Call it Nimbyism, call it whatever you like.
To my way of thinking it is nothing more than being sensible. There is no reason on God’s green earth why the services of the reentry facility can’t be provided in the current prisons. This reentry facility is nothing more than a ploy to increase the number of prison beds, pure and simple. At least the state should be more up front about what this really is all about.
LACK OF COMMUNICATION FROM GOV’T = ATTEMPTS TO CUT OFF PUBLIC INPUT
We see this play out at the county level and the Davis City Council level repeatedly. It is nothing more than a political tactic to create “plausible deniability”. If politicians have nothing to hide, then they should be willing to take whatever heat comes from public comment, as well as listen with an open mind. But more often than not, politicians don’t want public input, bc their minds are already made up from hidden agendas. In the case of the Bd of Sups, they want a “free” $30 million dollars of state funding.
However, nothing in life is ever truly “free”. There is always a price to pay. As Matt Rexroad has admitted, the reentry facility could easily morph into a regular prison. He has stated he didn’t think Davis needed to be consulted. Funny, the citizens of Woodland don’t want the reentry facility in their backyard, and I don’t blame them. Neither do we. Call it Nimbyism, call it whatever you like.
To my way of thinking it is nothing more than being sensible. There is no reason on God’s green earth why the services of the reentry facility can’t be provided in the current prisons. This reentry facility is nothing more than a ploy to increase the number of prison beds, pure and simple. At least the state should be more up front about what this really is all about.
LACK OF COMMUNICATION FROM GOV’T = ATTEMPTS TO CUT OFF PUBLIC INPUT
We see this play out at the county level and the Davis City Council level repeatedly. It is nothing more than a political tactic to create “plausible deniability”. If politicians have nothing to hide, then they should be willing to take whatever heat comes from public comment, as well as listen with an open mind. But more often than not, politicians don’t want public input, bc their minds are already made up from hidden agendas. In the case of the Bd of Sups, they want a “free” $30 million dollars of state funding.
However, nothing in life is ever truly “free”. There is always a price to pay. As Matt Rexroad has admitted, the reentry facility could easily morph into a regular prison. He has stated he didn’t think Davis needed to be consulted. Funny, the citizens of Woodland don’t want the reentry facility in their backyard, and I don’t blame them. Neither do we. Call it Nimbyism, call it whatever you like.
To my way of thinking it is nothing more than being sensible. There is no reason on God’s green earth why the services of the reentry facility can’t be provided in the current prisons. This reentry facility is nothing more than a ploy to increase the number of prison beds, pure and simple. At least the state should be more up front about what this really is all about.
LACK OF COMMUNICATION FROM GOV’T = ATTEMPTS TO CUT OFF PUBLIC INPUT
We see this play out at the county level and the Davis City Council level repeatedly. It is nothing more than a political tactic to create “plausible deniability”. If politicians have nothing to hide, then they should be willing to take whatever heat comes from public comment, as well as listen with an open mind. But more often than not, politicians don’t want public input, bc their minds are already made up from hidden agendas. In the case of the Bd of Sups, they want a “free” $30 million dollars of state funding.
However, nothing in life is ever truly “free”. There is always a price to pay. As Matt Rexroad has admitted, the reentry facility could easily morph into a regular prison. He has stated he didn’t think Davis needed to be consulted. Funny, the citizens of Woodland don’t want the reentry facility in their backyard, and I don’t blame them. Neither do we. Call it Nimbyism, call it whatever you like.
To my way of thinking it is nothing more than being sensible. There is no reason on God’s green earth why the services of the reentry facility can’t be provided in the current prisons. This reentry facility is nothing more than a ploy to increase the number of prison beds, pure and simple. At least the state should be more up front about what this really is all about.
Correction of my moniker!
Correction of my moniker!
Correction of my moniker!
Correction of my moniker!
Let’s try that again!!! Correction yet again!!!
Let’s try that again!!! Correction yet again!!!
Let’s try that again!!! Correction yet again!!!
Let’s try that again!!! Correction yet again!!!
Much Davis posturing over nothing as usual. They gave a near Davis consideration to appear consistent and fair to other county areas.
Once again really much ado over nothing.
I’m begining to get a scent here. If the facility can get a little further up the 16, the county can tap into the spectacularly funded Rumsey Rancheria emergency services. Can you see the potential deals to be cut here!!
Much Davis posturing over nothing as usual. They gave a near Davis consideration to appear consistent and fair to other county areas.
Once again really much ado over nothing.
I’m begining to get a scent here. If the facility can get a little further up the 16, the county can tap into the spectacularly funded Rumsey Rancheria emergency services. Can you see the potential deals to be cut here!!
Much Davis posturing over nothing as usual. They gave a near Davis consideration to appear consistent and fair to other county areas.
Once again really much ado over nothing.
I’m begining to get a scent here. If the facility can get a little further up the 16, the county can tap into the spectacularly funded Rumsey Rancheria emergency services. Can you see the potential deals to be cut here!!
Much Davis posturing over nothing as usual. They gave a near Davis consideration to appear consistent and fair to other county areas.
Once again really much ado over nothing.
I’m begining to get a scent here. If the facility can get a little further up the 16, the county can tap into the spectacularly funded Rumsey Rancheria emergency services. Can you see the potential deals to be cut here!!
Thanks for the honest answer Matt.
If the state wants to change this over time to some other sort of prison they can do so. Personally I think this is their game and it works like this:
Offer the county money they don’t want to turn down for something they need, in this case a new jail addition, contingent upon the county taking some sort of Corrections Department development.In this case that development is a re-entry facility.
Give the municipalities veto power over the location of the facility, which, of course, they will use to stop it from being in their communities.
Build it out in some lower population area of the county where there are not the correct services available to meet the needs of a re-entry facility so it will fail.
When it fails change the mission of the institution to some other type of Corrections facility that maintains the employment base created by the re-entry facility. Perhaps the new program might be some sort of minimum or medium security facility that grows and eventually becomes a much bigger prison complex.
Personally I don’t really care one way or another what the county does on this. I just think everyone should go into this with their eyes wide open and not minimize the potential for my scenario to play out over the next ten years. Remember the only things harder to site than prisons are nuclear power plants and garbage dumps. Pelican Bay started out as a plan to build a minimum security prison but changed over time into the big house that it is today. Corrections knows how to play this game. The big question for the County is do we want to become part of the prison industry knowing what the final outcome might be?
Thanks for the honest answer Matt.
If the state wants to change this over time to some other sort of prison they can do so. Personally I think this is their game and it works like this:
Offer the county money they don’t want to turn down for something they need, in this case a new jail addition, contingent upon the county taking some sort of Corrections Department development.In this case that development is a re-entry facility.
Give the municipalities veto power over the location of the facility, which, of course, they will use to stop it from being in their communities.
Build it out in some lower population area of the county where there are not the correct services available to meet the needs of a re-entry facility so it will fail.
When it fails change the mission of the institution to some other type of Corrections facility that maintains the employment base created by the re-entry facility. Perhaps the new program might be some sort of minimum or medium security facility that grows and eventually becomes a much bigger prison complex.
Personally I don’t really care one way or another what the county does on this. I just think everyone should go into this with their eyes wide open and not minimize the potential for my scenario to play out over the next ten years. Remember the only things harder to site than prisons are nuclear power plants and garbage dumps. Pelican Bay started out as a plan to build a minimum security prison but changed over time into the big house that it is today. Corrections knows how to play this game. The big question for the County is do we want to become part of the prison industry knowing what the final outcome might be?
Thanks for the honest answer Matt.
If the state wants to change this over time to some other sort of prison they can do so. Personally I think this is their game and it works like this:
Offer the county money they don’t want to turn down for something they need, in this case a new jail addition, contingent upon the county taking some sort of Corrections Department development.In this case that development is a re-entry facility.
Give the municipalities veto power over the location of the facility, which, of course, they will use to stop it from being in their communities.
Build it out in some lower population area of the county where there are not the correct services available to meet the needs of a re-entry facility so it will fail.
When it fails change the mission of the institution to some other type of Corrections facility that maintains the employment base created by the re-entry facility. Perhaps the new program might be some sort of minimum or medium security facility that grows and eventually becomes a much bigger prison complex.
Personally I don’t really care one way or another what the county does on this. I just think everyone should go into this with their eyes wide open and not minimize the potential for my scenario to play out over the next ten years. Remember the only things harder to site than prisons are nuclear power plants and garbage dumps. Pelican Bay started out as a plan to build a minimum security prison but changed over time into the big house that it is today. Corrections knows how to play this game. The big question for the County is do we want to become part of the prison industry knowing what the final outcome might be?
Thanks for the honest answer Matt.
If the state wants to change this over time to some other sort of prison they can do so. Personally I think this is their game and it works like this:
Offer the county money they don’t want to turn down for something they need, in this case a new jail addition, contingent upon the county taking some sort of Corrections Department development.In this case that development is a re-entry facility.
Give the municipalities veto power over the location of the facility, which, of course, they will use to stop it from being in their communities.
Build it out in some lower population area of the county where there are not the correct services available to meet the needs of a re-entry facility so it will fail.
When it fails change the mission of the institution to some other type of Corrections facility that maintains the employment base created by the re-entry facility. Perhaps the new program might be some sort of minimum or medium security facility that grows and eventually becomes a much bigger prison complex.
Personally I don’t really care one way or another what the county does on this. I just think everyone should go into this with their eyes wide open and not minimize the potential for my scenario to play out over the next ten years. Remember the only things harder to site than prisons are nuclear power plants and garbage dumps. Pelican Bay started out as a plan to build a minimum security prison but changed over time into the big house that it is today. Corrections knows how to play this game. The big question for the County is do we want to become part of the prison industry knowing what the final outcome might be?
Euthanize all of them.
Euthanize all of them.
Euthanize all of them.
Euthanize all of them.
bb – Placer County turned down the re-entry facility and funded the expansion of their jail themselves with money that they collected through development impact fees. Maybe the County could do the same – build a slew of houses and use the fees to expand the jail.
Or they could OK a re-entry facility on 15 acres that would provide services to prisoners who will be shortly released into the community.
bb – Placer County turned down the re-entry facility and funded the expansion of their jail themselves with money that they collected through development impact fees. Maybe the County could do the same – build a slew of houses and use the fees to expand the jail.
Or they could OK a re-entry facility on 15 acres that would provide services to prisoners who will be shortly released into the community.
bb – Placer County turned down the re-entry facility and funded the expansion of their jail themselves with money that they collected through development impact fees. Maybe the County could do the same – build a slew of houses and use the fees to expand the jail.
Or they could OK a re-entry facility on 15 acres that would provide services to prisoners who will be shortly released into the community.
bb – Placer County turned down the re-entry facility and funded the expansion of their jail themselves with money that they collected through development impact fees. Maybe the County could do the same – build a slew of houses and use the fees to expand the jail.
Or they could OK a re-entry facility on 15 acres that would provide services to prisoners who will be shortly released into the community.
Mike Harrington – The Yolo County Airport is more West of Davis than North. The fire station that may aid the Yolo County airport might be the West Davis station, if the local services couldn’t handle it.
The Yolo County Airport has a fire station. This could be expanded for the benefit of that area of the county.
Something like this would not trigger the need for a 4th fire station in Northeast Davis.
Mike Harrington – The Yolo County Airport is more West of Davis than North. The fire station that may aid the Yolo County airport might be the West Davis station, if the local services couldn’t handle it.
The Yolo County Airport has a fire station. This could be expanded for the benefit of that area of the county.
Something like this would not trigger the need for a 4th fire station in Northeast Davis.
Mike Harrington – The Yolo County Airport is more West of Davis than North. The fire station that may aid the Yolo County airport might be the West Davis station, if the local services couldn’t handle it.
The Yolo County Airport has a fire station. This could be expanded for the benefit of that area of the county.
Something like this would not trigger the need for a 4th fire station in Northeast Davis.
Mike Harrington – The Yolo County Airport is more West of Davis than North. The fire station that may aid the Yolo County airport might be the West Davis station, if the local services couldn’t handle it.
The Yolo County Airport has a fire station. This could be expanded for the benefit of that area of the county.
Something like this would not trigger the need for a 4th fire station in Northeast Davis.
I think the point Mike is making is that that is the logical area for the new fire station and then it would enable the city to shift the focus of other stations like that in central and west Davis toward other parts of town.
I think the point Mike is making is that that is the logical area for the new fire station and then it would enable the city to shift the focus of other stations like that in central and west Davis toward other parts of town.
I think the point Mike is making is that that is the logical area for the new fire station and then it would enable the city to shift the focus of other stations like that in central and west Davis toward other parts of town.
I think the point Mike is making is that that is the logical area for the new fire station and then it would enable the city to shift the focus of other stations like that in central and west Davis toward other parts of town.
Mike Harrington said…
Rich,
The Yolo Airport fire station is not large enough to handle the job.
As for the 4th Fire Station, ANY major new development north of Covell that is in the David area requires a fourth fire station. It is not a ruse by the fire fighters. The response times north of Covell are poor at best, due to the distance and volume of calls.
I think the City should provide some sort of medical-only response program, especially north of Covell. Maybe a medical facility/station would help. But until someone shows me that a new medical response program will work, I have to take the position that Lewis Homes, Covell Village, Northwest Quadrant, or the reentry facility at Yolo Airport, simply has to pay for the 4th fire station.
Mike, given the fact that something like 85% of the responses made by the Fire Department are not for fire, but rather for medical, don’t you think it is possible that our current deployment of Fire resources is inefficient? Perhaps we need less Fire capability, and more Ambulance capability.
Thoughts?
Mike Harrington said…
Rich,
The Yolo Airport fire station is not large enough to handle the job.
As for the 4th Fire Station, ANY major new development north of Covell that is in the David area requires a fourth fire station. It is not a ruse by the fire fighters. The response times north of Covell are poor at best, due to the distance and volume of calls.
I think the City should provide some sort of medical-only response program, especially north of Covell. Maybe a medical facility/station would help. But until someone shows me that a new medical response program will work, I have to take the position that Lewis Homes, Covell Village, Northwest Quadrant, or the reentry facility at Yolo Airport, simply has to pay for the 4th fire station.
Mike, given the fact that something like 85% of the responses made by the Fire Department are not for fire, but rather for medical, don’t you think it is possible that our current deployment of Fire resources is inefficient? Perhaps we need less Fire capability, and more Ambulance capability.
Thoughts?
Mike Harrington said…
Rich,
The Yolo Airport fire station is not large enough to handle the job.
As for the 4th Fire Station, ANY major new development north of Covell that is in the David area requires a fourth fire station. It is not a ruse by the fire fighters. The response times north of Covell are poor at best, due to the distance and volume of calls.
I think the City should provide some sort of medical-only response program, especially north of Covell. Maybe a medical facility/station would help. But until someone shows me that a new medical response program will work, I have to take the position that Lewis Homes, Covell Village, Northwest Quadrant, or the reentry facility at Yolo Airport, simply has to pay for the 4th fire station.
Mike, given the fact that something like 85% of the responses made by the Fire Department are not for fire, but rather for medical, don’t you think it is possible that our current deployment of Fire resources is inefficient? Perhaps we need less Fire capability, and more Ambulance capability.
Thoughts?
Mike Harrington said…
Rich,
The Yolo Airport fire station is not large enough to handle the job.
As for the 4th Fire Station, ANY major new development north of Covell that is in the David area requires a fourth fire station. It is not a ruse by the fire fighters. The response times north of Covell are poor at best, due to the distance and volume of calls.
I think the City should provide some sort of medical-only response program, especially north of Covell. Maybe a medical facility/station would help. But until someone shows me that a new medical response program will work, I have to take the position that Lewis Homes, Covell Village, Northwest Quadrant, or the reentry facility at Yolo Airport, simply has to pay for the 4th fire station.
Mike, given the fact that something like 85% of the responses made by the Fire Department are not for fire, but rather for medical, don’t you think it is possible that our current deployment of Fire resources is inefficient? Perhaps we need less Fire capability, and more Ambulance capability.
Thoughts?
Rich,
You should look into the county-city-AMR relationship.
I think there is a state law that gives counties the right to operate the ambulance services, unless they give it up to a city.
Here, Yolo’s ambulance contract is a huge net loss when you look at runs made all over the county, except Davis. For Davis runs, most of the patients have insurance. For the rest of the county, most do not.
So, global warming will flood Yolo County before the County allows Davis to do its own ambulance carries. The County must have Davis patients to subsidize the ambulance services.
I do know that the Davis Fire trucks are almost always first at an accident site, well ahead of the AMR ambulances.
We really should have an ambulance service (composed of our firefighters with extra training) for the City, but the County won’t give up the insured patients.
If the Blog or someone really looked close at the law, history, and current operations, maybe a solution could be found. There are a lot of entrenched interests in the current status quo, and I know when I was on the CC no one on the CC looked into it. Staff never wanted to deal with it, either.
After I left, the CC commissioned an operational study of the Fire Department. I have never seen the final report, but I am certain that it would be very, very interesting reading to many customers of the Blog.
Rich,
You should look into the county-city-AMR relationship.
I think there is a state law that gives counties the right to operate the ambulance services, unless they give it up to a city.
Here, Yolo’s ambulance contract is a huge net loss when you look at runs made all over the county, except Davis. For Davis runs, most of the patients have insurance. For the rest of the county, most do not.
So, global warming will flood Yolo County before the County allows Davis to do its own ambulance carries. The County must have Davis patients to subsidize the ambulance services.
I do know that the Davis Fire trucks are almost always first at an accident site, well ahead of the AMR ambulances.
We really should have an ambulance service (composed of our firefighters with extra training) for the City, but the County won’t give up the insured patients.
If the Blog or someone really looked close at the law, history, and current operations, maybe a solution could be found. There are a lot of entrenched interests in the current status quo, and I know when I was on the CC no one on the CC looked into it. Staff never wanted to deal with it, either.
After I left, the CC commissioned an operational study of the Fire Department. I have never seen the final report, but I am certain that it would be very, very interesting reading to many customers of the Blog.
Rich,
You should look into the county-city-AMR relationship.
I think there is a state law that gives counties the right to operate the ambulance services, unless they give it up to a city.
Here, Yolo’s ambulance contract is a huge net loss when you look at runs made all over the county, except Davis. For Davis runs, most of the patients have insurance. For the rest of the county, most do not.
So, global warming will flood Yolo County before the County allows Davis to do its own ambulance carries. The County must have Davis patients to subsidize the ambulance services.
I do know that the Davis Fire trucks are almost always first at an accident site, well ahead of the AMR ambulances.
We really should have an ambulance service (composed of our firefighters with extra training) for the City, but the County won’t give up the insured patients.
If the Blog or someone really looked close at the law, history, and current operations, maybe a solution could be found. There are a lot of entrenched interests in the current status quo, and I know when I was on the CC no one on the CC looked into it. Staff never wanted to deal with it, either.
After I left, the CC commissioned an operational study of the Fire Department. I have never seen the final report, but I am certain that it would be very, very interesting reading to many customers of the Blog.
Rich,
You should look into the county-city-AMR relationship.
I think there is a state law that gives counties the right to operate the ambulance services, unless they give it up to a city.
Here, Yolo’s ambulance contract is a huge net loss when you look at runs made all over the county, except Davis. For Davis runs, most of the patients have insurance. For the rest of the county, most do not.
So, global warming will flood Yolo County before the County allows Davis to do its own ambulance carries. The County must have Davis patients to subsidize the ambulance services.
I do know that the Davis Fire trucks are almost always first at an accident site, well ahead of the AMR ambulances.
We really should have an ambulance service (composed of our firefighters with extra training) for the City, but the County won’t give up the insured patients.
If the Blog or someone really looked close at the law, history, and current operations, maybe a solution could be found. There are a lot of entrenched interests in the current status quo, and I know when I was on the CC no one on the CC looked into it. Staff never wanted to deal with it, either.
After I left, the CC commissioned an operational study of the Fire Department. I have never seen the final report, but I am certain that it would be very, very interesting reading to many customers of the Blog.
One more point: my cursory analysis is that 2 of the 3 city fire stations have room on the lots to add an extra fire truck bay. So, instead of adding a new 4th fire station, the city could add capability by adding an extra pair of trucks to the stations. It would mean a lot more money, obviously, but less than building a new station.
I’ve lived and worked across the back fence from the downtown fire station for 13 years, and I find them to be good neighbors. They rarely turn on the Code 3 sirens going right out of the driveway, unless traffic is heavy on Fifth. At night they usually wait a block or two, and then only when necessary.
One more point: my cursory analysis is that 2 of the 3 city fire stations have room on the lots to add an extra fire truck bay. So, instead of adding a new 4th fire station, the city could add capability by adding an extra pair of trucks to the stations. It would mean a lot more money, obviously, but less than building a new station.
I’ve lived and worked across the back fence from the downtown fire station for 13 years, and I find them to be good neighbors. They rarely turn on the Code 3 sirens going right out of the driveway, unless traffic is heavy on Fifth. At night they usually wait a block or two, and then only when necessary.
One more point: my cursory analysis is that 2 of the 3 city fire stations have room on the lots to add an extra fire truck bay. So, instead of adding a new 4th fire station, the city could add capability by adding an extra pair of trucks to the stations. It would mean a lot more money, obviously, but less than building a new station.
I’ve lived and worked across the back fence from the downtown fire station for 13 years, and I find them to be good neighbors. They rarely turn on the Code 3 sirens going right out of the driveway, unless traffic is heavy on Fifth. At night they usually wait a block or two, and then only when necessary.
One more point: my cursory analysis is that 2 of the 3 city fire stations have room on the lots to add an extra fire truck bay. So, instead of adding a new 4th fire station, the city could add capability by adding an extra pair of trucks to the stations. It would mean a lot more money, obviously, but less than building a new station.
I’ve lived and worked across the back fence from the downtown fire station for 13 years, and I find them to be good neighbors. They rarely turn on the Code 3 sirens going right out of the driveway, unless traffic is heavy on Fifth. At night they usually wait a block or two, and then only when necessary.
“Rich,
You should look into the county-city-AMR relationship.”
I have.
“I think there is a state law that gives counties the right to operate the ambulance services, unless they give it up to a city.”
That’s just how Fire Chief Conroy explained it to me.
Nevertheless, 40% of the supervisors are elected by Davis residents.
“I do know that the Davis Fire trucks are almost always first at an accident site, well ahead of the AMR ambulances.”
You know that?! What is your source for that information?
It is just the opposite of what AMR ambulance personnel in Davis told me, saying that they “always beat the fire trucks to calls.” I never quoted AMR saying that in my column, as it was anecdotal and I don’t believe such data is officially logged.
“We really should have an ambulance service (composed of our firefighters with extra training) for the City, but the County won’t give up the insured patients.”
I DISAGREE 100%.
Because the firefighters are so much more expensive (and less trained for medical response), I have no idea why anyone would would consider that.
Also, what is your source on the insured patients percentages? I really doubt your numbers.
“There are a lot of entrenched interests in the current status quo, and I know when I was on the CC no one on the CC looked into it. Staff never wanted to deal with it, either.”
The entrenched interest — that is, the party which is gaming the system and making the most money off of it — is the firefighters.
The worst thing we could do would be to add another fire station, given that we don’t have a problem with response times to fires. Doing so would just add to the extreme expense of the DFD, something we currently cannot afford (as the public works department could tell you).
We also do not have a problem with the times to medical emergencies. If you look at state and regional averages, our response times are below average.
If we find we need another ambulance, then our CC should petition the county, where Davis people have a lot of say.
“Rich,
You should look into the county-city-AMR relationship.”
I have.
“I think there is a state law that gives counties the right to operate the ambulance services, unless they give it up to a city.”
That’s just how Fire Chief Conroy explained it to me.
Nevertheless, 40% of the supervisors are elected by Davis residents.
“I do know that the Davis Fire trucks are almost always first at an accident site, well ahead of the AMR ambulances.”
You know that?! What is your source for that information?
It is just the opposite of what AMR ambulance personnel in Davis told me, saying that they “always beat the fire trucks to calls.” I never quoted AMR saying that in my column, as it was anecdotal and I don’t believe such data is officially logged.
“We really should have an ambulance service (composed of our firefighters with extra training) for the City, but the County won’t give up the insured patients.”
I DISAGREE 100%.
Because the firefighters are so much more expensive (and less trained for medical response), I have no idea why anyone would would consider that.
Also, what is your source on the insured patients percentages? I really doubt your numbers.
“There are a lot of entrenched interests in the current status quo, and I know when I was on the CC no one on the CC looked into it. Staff never wanted to deal with it, either.”
The entrenched interest — that is, the party which is gaming the system and making the most money off of it — is the firefighters.
The worst thing we could do would be to add another fire station, given that we don’t have a problem with response times to fires. Doing so would just add to the extreme expense of the DFD, something we currently cannot afford (as the public works department could tell you).
We also do not have a problem with the times to medical emergencies. If you look at state and regional averages, our response times are below average.
If we find we need another ambulance, then our CC should petition the county, where Davis people have a lot of say.
“Rich,
You should look into the county-city-AMR relationship.”
I have.
“I think there is a state law that gives counties the right to operate the ambulance services, unless they give it up to a city.”
That’s just how Fire Chief Conroy explained it to me.
Nevertheless, 40% of the supervisors are elected by Davis residents.
“I do know that the Davis Fire trucks are almost always first at an accident site, well ahead of the AMR ambulances.”
You know that?! What is your source for that information?
It is just the opposite of what AMR ambulance personnel in Davis told me, saying that they “always beat the fire trucks to calls.” I never quoted AMR saying that in my column, as it was anecdotal and I don’t believe such data is officially logged.
“We really should have an ambulance service (composed of our firefighters with extra training) for the City, but the County won’t give up the insured patients.”
I DISAGREE 100%.
Because the firefighters are so much more expensive (and less trained for medical response), I have no idea why anyone would would consider that.
Also, what is your source on the insured patients percentages? I really doubt your numbers.
“There are a lot of entrenched interests in the current status quo, and I know when I was on the CC no one on the CC looked into it. Staff never wanted to deal with it, either.”
The entrenched interest — that is, the party which is gaming the system and making the most money off of it — is the firefighters.
The worst thing we could do would be to add another fire station, given that we don’t have a problem with response times to fires. Doing so would just add to the extreme expense of the DFD, something we currently cannot afford (as the public works department could tell you).
We also do not have a problem with the times to medical emergencies. If you look at state and regional averages, our response times are below average.
If we find we need another ambulance, then our CC should petition the county, where Davis people have a lot of say.
“Rich,
You should look into the county-city-AMR relationship.”
I have.
“I think there is a state law that gives counties the right to operate the ambulance services, unless they give it up to a city.”
That’s just how Fire Chief Conroy explained it to me.
Nevertheless, 40% of the supervisors are elected by Davis residents.
“I do know that the Davis Fire trucks are almost always first at an accident site, well ahead of the AMR ambulances.”
You know that?! What is your source for that information?
It is just the opposite of what AMR ambulance personnel in Davis told me, saying that they “always beat the fire trucks to calls.” I never quoted AMR saying that in my column, as it was anecdotal and I don’t believe such data is officially logged.
“We really should have an ambulance service (composed of our firefighters with extra training) for the City, but the County won’t give up the insured patients.”
I DISAGREE 100%.
Because the firefighters are so much more expensive (and less trained for medical response), I have no idea why anyone would would consider that.
Also, what is your source on the insured patients percentages? I really doubt your numbers.
“There are a lot of entrenched interests in the current status quo, and I know when I was on the CC no one on the CC looked into it. Staff never wanted to deal with it, either.”
The entrenched interest — that is, the party which is gaming the system and making the most money off of it — is the firefighters.
The worst thing we could do would be to add another fire station, given that we don’t have a problem with response times to fires. Doing so would just add to the extreme expense of the DFD, something we currently cannot afford (as the public works department could tell you).
We also do not have a problem with the times to medical emergencies. If you look at state and regional averages, our response times are below average.
If we find we need another ambulance, then our CC should petition the county, where Davis people have a lot of say.
“…instead of adding a new 4th fire station, the city could add capability by adding an extra pair of trucks to the stations. It would mean a lot more money, obviously, but less than building a new station.”
We DO NOT NEED MORE FIRE FIGHTERS or more fire trucks!
We rarely have serious fires, and when we do, our fire department does a good job responding to them.
If we need an ambulance, then we need to petition the county and the JPA.
“…instead of adding a new 4th fire station, the city could add capability by adding an extra pair of trucks to the stations. It would mean a lot more money, obviously, but less than building a new station.”
We DO NOT NEED MORE FIRE FIGHTERS or more fire trucks!
We rarely have serious fires, and when we do, our fire department does a good job responding to them.
If we need an ambulance, then we need to petition the county and the JPA.
“…instead of adding a new 4th fire station, the city could add capability by adding an extra pair of trucks to the stations. It would mean a lot more money, obviously, but less than building a new station.”
We DO NOT NEED MORE FIRE FIGHTERS or more fire trucks!
We rarely have serious fires, and when we do, our fire department does a good job responding to them.
If we need an ambulance, then we need to petition the county and the JPA.
“…instead of adding a new 4th fire station, the city could add capability by adding an extra pair of trucks to the stations. It would mean a lot more money, obviously, but less than building a new station.”
We DO NOT NEED MORE FIRE FIGHTERS or more fire trucks!
We rarely have serious fires, and when we do, our fire department does a good job responding to them.
If we need an ambulance, then we need to petition the county and the JPA.
I strongly concur with Rich on this issue. The amount of money spent per actual fire in Davis would be an extremely interesting stat to see.
There are going to have to be some tough budgetary decisions in the comming months and years. Dealing with firefighting spending may not be low-hanging fruit, but it is very ripe fruit.
I strongly concur with Rich on this issue. The amount of money spent per actual fire in Davis would be an extremely interesting stat to see.
There are going to have to be some tough budgetary decisions in the comming months and years. Dealing with firefighting spending may not be low-hanging fruit, but it is very ripe fruit.
I strongly concur with Rich on this issue. The amount of money spent per actual fire in Davis would be an extremely interesting stat to see.
There are going to have to be some tough budgetary decisions in the comming months and years. Dealing with firefighting spending may not be low-hanging fruit, but it is very ripe fruit.
I strongly concur with Rich on this issue. The amount of money spent per actual fire in Davis would be an extremely interesting stat to see.
There are going to have to be some tough budgetary decisions in the comming months and years. Dealing with firefighting spending may not be low-hanging fruit, but it is very ripe fruit.
Did I hear..”low hanging fruit”??
Matt Rexroad said: “they are looking for 15 acres”. Fine.
The out moded Yolo County Fair Grounds would be a perfect 15 acres!!
Did I hear..”low hanging fruit”??
Matt Rexroad said: “they are looking for 15 acres”. Fine.
The out moded Yolo County Fair Grounds would be a perfect 15 acres!!
Did I hear..”low hanging fruit”??
Matt Rexroad said: “they are looking for 15 acres”. Fine.
The out moded Yolo County Fair Grounds would be a perfect 15 acres!!
Did I hear..”low hanging fruit”??
Matt Rexroad said: “they are looking for 15 acres”. Fine.
The out moded Yolo County Fair Grounds would be a perfect 15 acres!!
Old Skool Davis said…
Did I hear..”low hanging fruit”??
Matt Rexroad said: “they are looking for 15 acres”. Fine.
The out moded Yolo County Fair Grounds would be a perfect 15 acres!!
Interesting idea OSD. To what new site would you relocate the Fairgrounds?
Old Skool Davis said…
Did I hear..”low hanging fruit”??
Matt Rexroad said: “they are looking for 15 acres”. Fine.
The out moded Yolo County Fair Grounds would be a perfect 15 acres!!
Interesting idea OSD. To what new site would you relocate the Fairgrounds?
Old Skool Davis said…
Did I hear..”low hanging fruit”??
Matt Rexroad said: “they are looking for 15 acres”. Fine.
The out moded Yolo County Fair Grounds would be a perfect 15 acres!!
Interesting idea OSD. To what new site would you relocate the Fairgrounds?
Old Skool Davis said…
Did I hear..”low hanging fruit”??
Matt Rexroad said: “they are looking for 15 acres”. Fine.
The out moded Yolo County Fair Grounds would be a perfect 15 acres!!
Interesting idea OSD. To what new site would you relocate the Fairgrounds?
Mike’s suggestion to increase the number of fire trucks at each station is just something he has come up with to appease the fire fighters and not something based on analysis of actual need.
I doubt that much of the what Mike has stated is based on any actual study. There may be anecdotal information, but nothing official. In my experience, the ambulances arrive promptly after called.
Mike’s suggestion to increase the number of fire trucks at each station is just something he has come up with to appease the fire fighters and not something based on analysis of actual need.
I doubt that much of the what Mike has stated is based on any actual study. There may be anecdotal information, but nothing official. In my experience, the ambulances arrive promptly after called.
Mike’s suggestion to increase the number of fire trucks at each station is just something he has come up with to appease the fire fighters and not something based on analysis of actual need.
I doubt that much of the what Mike has stated is based on any actual study. There may be anecdotal information, but nothing official. In my experience, the ambulances arrive promptly after called.
Mike’s suggestion to increase the number of fire trucks at each station is just something he has come up with to appease the fire fighters and not something based on analysis of actual need.
I doubt that much of the what Mike has stated is based on any actual study. There may be anecdotal information, but nothing official. In my experience, the ambulances arrive promptly after called.
How about placing it at the defunct Wild Wings golf course?
The owners have defaulted on 190K in water fees plus 35K in property taxes and want the county to take it over.
How about placing it at the defunct Wild Wings golf course?
The owners have defaulted on 190K in water fees plus 35K in property taxes and want the county to take it over.
How about placing it at the defunct Wild Wings golf course?
The owners have defaulted on 190K in water fees plus 35K in property taxes and want the county to take it over.
How about placing it at the defunct Wild Wings golf course?
The owners have defaulted on 190K in water fees plus 35K in property taxes and want the county to take it over.
“Mike’s suggestion to increase the number of fire trucks at each station is just something he has come up with to appease the fire fighters”
Mike Harrington has no credibility on fire department issues. When he was a councilman, he was part of the group which changed the retirement system to the 3 percent at fifty. That vote is today costing the city of Davis an additional $2 million a year and the bill keeps going up. No wonder the firemen are friendly to Mike.
“Mike’s suggestion to increase the number of fire trucks at each station is just something he has come up with to appease the fire fighters”
Mike Harrington has no credibility on fire department issues. When he was a councilman, he was part of the group which changed the retirement system to the 3 percent at fifty. That vote is today costing the city of Davis an additional $2 million a year and the bill keeps going up. No wonder the firemen are friendly to Mike.
“Mike’s suggestion to increase the number of fire trucks at each station is just something he has come up with to appease the fire fighters”
Mike Harrington has no credibility on fire department issues. When he was a councilman, he was part of the group which changed the retirement system to the 3 percent at fifty. That vote is today costing the city of Davis an additional $2 million a year and the bill keeps going up. No wonder the firemen are friendly to Mike.
“Mike’s suggestion to increase the number of fire trucks at each station is just something he has come up with to appease the fire fighters”
Mike Harrington has no credibility on fire department issues. When he was a councilman, he was part of the group which changed the retirement system to the 3 percent at fifty. That vote is today costing the city of Davis an additional $2 million a year and the bill keeps going up. No wonder the firemen are friendly to Mike.
Actually, the fire fighters really don’t like Mike that much. Mike apparently said something at a city council meeting early in his career that they thought implied that the Davis Fire Fighters were cowards. There was a city council meeting where fire fighters showed up pretty upset. Mike has been trying to make it up to them and repair the rift ever since without any satisfaction.
Actually, the fire fighters really don’t like Mike that much. Mike apparently said something at a city council meeting early in his career that they thought implied that the Davis Fire Fighters were cowards. There was a city council meeting where fire fighters showed up pretty upset. Mike has been trying to make it up to them and repair the rift ever since without any satisfaction.
Actually, the fire fighters really don’t like Mike that much. Mike apparently said something at a city council meeting early in his career that they thought implied that the Davis Fire Fighters were cowards. There was a city council meeting where fire fighters showed up pretty upset. Mike has been trying to make it up to them and repair the rift ever since without any satisfaction.
Actually, the fire fighters really don’t like Mike that much. Mike apparently said something at a city council meeting early in his career that they thought implied that the Davis Fire Fighters were cowards. There was a city council meeting where fire fighters showed up pretty upset. Mike has been trying to make it up to them and repair the rift ever since without any satisfaction.
I looked at the Yolo County GIS map. The Yolo County Airport is not in Davis’ Fire District. Davis’ Fire District extends east and south. So it is far reaching to say that placing the facility five miles west of Davis would trigger the building of a 4th fire station in the city of Davis. The location of the Yolo County airport is centrally located between Winters, Woodland and Davis. So would fire services have to be increased in Woodland and Winters as well? I think not.
I looked at the Yolo County GIS map. The Yolo County Airport is not in Davis’ Fire District. Davis’ Fire District extends east and south. So it is far reaching to say that placing the facility five miles west of Davis would trigger the building of a 4th fire station in the city of Davis. The location of the Yolo County airport is centrally located between Winters, Woodland and Davis. So would fire services have to be increased in Woodland and Winters as well? I think not.
I looked at the Yolo County GIS map. The Yolo County Airport is not in Davis’ Fire District. Davis’ Fire District extends east and south. So it is far reaching to say that placing the facility five miles west of Davis would trigger the building of a 4th fire station in the city of Davis. The location of the Yolo County airport is centrally located between Winters, Woodland and Davis. So would fire services have to be increased in Woodland and Winters as well? I think not.
I looked at the Yolo County GIS map. The Yolo County Airport is not in Davis’ Fire District. Davis’ Fire District extends east and south. So it is far reaching to say that placing the facility five miles west of Davis would trigger the building of a 4th fire station in the city of Davis. The location of the Yolo County airport is centrally located between Winters, Woodland and Davis. So would fire services have to be increased in Woodland and Winters as well? I think not.
“In terms of fighting fires, we have ABSOLUTELY NO NEED IN DAVIS FOR A FOURTH FIRE STATION — THIS IS A HUGE RUSE PUT ON US BY THE FIRE FIGHTERS UNION AND ITS SHILLS.”
That took some stones Rich. The Firefighters are going to be pretty pissy with you at the political gatherings, I imagine.
“In terms of fighting fires, we have ABSOLUTELY NO NEED IN DAVIS FOR A FOURTH FIRE STATION — THIS IS A HUGE RUSE PUT ON US BY THE FIRE FIGHTERS UNION AND ITS SHILLS.”
That took some stones Rich. The Firefighters are going to be pretty pissy with you at the political gatherings, I imagine.
“In terms of fighting fires, we have ABSOLUTELY NO NEED IN DAVIS FOR A FOURTH FIRE STATION — THIS IS A HUGE RUSE PUT ON US BY THE FIRE FIGHTERS UNION AND ITS SHILLS.”
That took some stones Rich. The Firefighters are going to be pretty pissy with you at the political gatherings, I imagine.
“In terms of fighting fires, we have ABSOLUTELY NO NEED IN DAVIS FOR A FOURTH FIRE STATION — THIS IS A HUGE RUSE PUT ON US BY THE FIRE FIGHTERS UNION AND ITS SHILLS.”
That took some stones Rich. The Firefighters are going to be pretty pissy with you at the political gatherings, I imagine.