A crowd of angry protesters took to the streets of Woodland after Woodland police early on Monday morning shot and killed a man that they said was carrying a knife.
According to a release from the Woodland Police Department on Monday morning at 5:51, Woodland police officers were dispatched to the 400 block of Elliot Street for a disturbance. It was reported to dispatch that a man was yelling or screaming in an apartment complex.
When officers arrived in the area they contacted a 53-year-old male Woodland resident at the College Manor Apartment complex. The suspect displayed a knife and threatened the arriving officers. Officers attempted to negotiate with the suspect, asking him to drop the knife.
The suspect then charged at one of the officers and that officer, fearing for his life, shot the suspect. The suspect was immediately transported by ambulance but was pronounced dead prior to arrival at the hospital.
The suspect’s name is not being released at this time so the Yolo County Coroner’s Office can make notifications to next of kin. No officers were injured in this incident.
The Davis Police Department is conducting the investigation of this officer-involved shooting.
Protesters were angered by the third police shooting in less than a year in Woodland. It was only on May 31, 2014, when Brandon Jimenez was shot and killed by Woodland police
The protestors saw the incident differently – they believed that the confrontation, which they say lasted only 15 seconds, could have been avoided and that the police had other options.
They believed the man was a greater threat to himself than anyone else.
FOX40 news reported that they “obtained new cell phone video, which showed the man running toward officers.” Within seconds, there were three gunshots fired at him. It could not be confirmed if the man was wielding a knife because the video was shot from too far away.
Police operate on a 21-foot rule which indicates that officers are trained not to allow a suspect within 21 feet of them. However, we heard expert testimony during the Gutierrez federal civil rights trial that at least called into question that training.
One of the protestors, Angela Apodaca, would write, “We are asking that police officers be trained to better deal with mentally ill people in a state of crisis. If they are responding to a 911 call regarding a suicidal person… or a person having a mental breakdown, why can they not have officers trained in intervention? DEADLY force is being used too often. Shooting to kill rather than to disarm, ESPECIALLY when it comes to the mentally ill, is unacceptable.”
The Yolo County Board of Supervisors recently approved a pilot program to become the first in the state to take advantage of SB 82, the Mental Health Wellness Act of 2013, and fund services that would lead to clinical staff accompanying law enforcement responding to mental health crises in Yolo County.
According to the county staff report, “These newly funded services are expected to lead to improved life outcomes for the persons served and improved system outcomes for mental health and its community partners. The Yolo County Department of Alcohol, Drug & Mental Health (ADMH) was successful in its response to this grant opportunity with a proposal to fund crisis personnel, including clinicians and peer counselors providing services in the community.”
The following agencies will participate: County Counsel; Local Mental Health Board; Winters, West Sacramento, Davis and Woodland Police Departments; City of West Sacramento; Yolo County Sheriff’s Department; Yolo Community Care Continuum; Woodland Memorial Hospital; Sutter Davis Hospital; and RISE Inc.
Videos of Protest
—David M. Greenwald reporting
That was great advice the crowd was chanting, “hands up, don’t shoot”. If the assailant had his hands up then the cops don’t shoot.
Given that he was mentally ill and non-responsive, that’s not a very helpful comment.
But he did charge the officer with a knife in hand.
that’s what’s being alleged. do we know that for a fact? the news report said that was inconclusive from the video they saw
Nothing in your chronology shows that the police had any indication of mental illness in “real time”… did you omit something?
I only printed the official release from the police.
One of the neighbors I saw on TV claimed that he was admitting he had a pistol….whether or not he in fact did, I have no idea…
The title of this should be — “A bunch of people from Sacramento came to Woodland to demonstrate about an incident that had nothing to do with what is going on in Missouri.”
Agree, from Sacramento and DAVIS.
you were there?
A lot of them were from Woodland and lifelong Woodland residents. Some weren’t.
People from Woodland will rarely admit that mistake.
Ah yes, the epic Woodland-Davis rivalry! It brings me back to the days when I used to read the Enterprise and Bob Dunning’s column.
They werent as “peaceful” as people want to believe! They were blocking traffic, standing in the road, I had to roll my windows up after I refused to hink for them!
Were they shouting slurs at you?
There were so many people all yelling at once. I have no idea what they were actually saying… They only thing I can honestly say I heard was one yelling to honk my horn in support.. It was so loud I just had to roll my windows up…
It seemed chaotic (best word I can think of)… people all over the place!
justme
I would like to understand your perspective on the word “peaceful”. For me, peaceful means non violent. It does not necessarily mean “quiet” and it does not necessarily mean “not inconvenient”. I see a stark contrast between the behavior of those who were standing on or in the street chanting and yelling and those in Ferguson who were clearly destroying property, looting and physically threatening police. I suspect from your posts that we likely draw the line for “peaceful” in different places.
I think the two cases are quite different.
In East St. Louis, we have an officer report that he was attacked in his police car, and the suspect (victim) was trying to take his firearm. Later in the confrontation, the victim turned and charged him – at 6’4″, 295 pounds. Fearing for his life, the officer discharged his weapon.
Last night a St. Louis crime reporter tweeted that over a dozen eye witnesses collaborate the officer’s story.
In this Woodland case, it sounds like there were multiple officers dealing with one person with a mental illness / breakdown.
Where were the tazers / rubber bullets? Do Woodland officers carry tazers?
P.S. As a youth I recall hearing that many police officers had trained in Golden Gloves (youth) boxing. I wonder if policies were different 50 years ago, and in practice did many officers protect themselves with simple hand-to-hand skills?
Our local police guru (who’s name slips me) may be able to comment and add insight.
TBD wrote:
> Where were the tazers
I don’t know about Woodland, but many departments have eliminated tasers after so many deaths from the “non-leathal” device:
http://www.thebureauinvestigates.com/2012/05/15/new-research-suggests-tasers-can-be-lethal/
I know tazers can be lethal, but aren’t they still less lethal than two shots from a firearm?
David wrote:
> They (the protestors) believed the man was a greater threat to himself than anyone else.
It looks like the person who actually saw the guy and called 911 didn’t think that…
A few years back a family was upset that cops shot their “peaceful” son with mental issues and when the 911 tape came out the Mom told the dispatcher “get a cop here as fast as possible I think he is going to kill us”.
I’m fine if “protestors” want to respond to all “crazy person with a knife 911” calls, but they should not expect a cop (who wants to go home at the end of his shift) to do anything other than shoot someone who comes at them with a knife or who is trying to get their gun.
“It looks like the person who actually saw the guy and called 911 didn’t think that…”
Actually, we don’t know that. We don’t know why the police were called or the motivation behind it. I think this illustrates the need to expedite the SB 82 program.
David wrote:
> Actually, we don’t know that.
Yes we (probably) do know that since when a person is not some kind of threat to them people (almost) never call the police.
P.S. Any idea if the public can get 911 tapes in Yolo County (like they can in other counties)? I’ll mail a $100 cash donation to the Vanguard PO Box if the police release a tape (or official transcript) of the 911 call that has the caller saying “I think he is a greater threat to himself than anyone else”…
SouthofDavis
“Yes we (probably) do know that since when a person is not some kind of threat to them people (almost) never call the police.”
There is another circumstance in which people call “911” ( not necessarily the police) and that is when they perceive that an individual is about to harm themselves. Examples would be a family member who is threatening to kill themselves or a “jumper” spotted on a bridge or when they believe that an individual is not operating in the same realm of reality that we operate on, as the individual who is clearly responding to auditory or visual hallucinations.
There is a distinction to be made between calling “911” and calling the police. The question is whether the community has a system set up to differentiate between different types of “911” calls
or whether the police are the default responders.
For another approach, you might want to check out the San Antonio model in the links I posted
on today’s thread on this subject.
In the Woodland case, is the police department virtually all Caucasian, as is the case in Ferguson?
Was the Woodland victim of the shooting stopped by a police car around which the altercation/confusion took place, and not at all representative of the community it serves, as is the case in Ferguson?
Did the victim of the shooting in Woodland go after the officer’s gun, as in the case in Ferguson?
Was the Woodland victim of the shooting mentally competent, as was the case in Ferguson?
Did the Woodland victim of the shooting just come from committing a strong-arm robbery at a convenience store, as was the case in Ferguson?
If your answers to the above questions are “no”, then perhaps the “Ferguson” controversy is being interjected into a local situation that is not applicable.
Anon —
Your post has a lot of wrong information in it.
“In the Woodland case, is the police department virtually all Caucasian, as is the case in Ferguson?”
yes
“Was the Woodland victim of the shooting stopped by a police car around which the altercation/confusion took place, and not at all representative of the community it serves, as is the case in Ferguson?”
not sure why that’s relevant
Did the victim of the shooting in Woodland go after the officer’s gun, as in the case in Ferguson?
“Was the Woodland victim of the shooting mentally competent, as was the case in Ferguson?”
not sure why that’s relevant
“Did the Woodland victim of the shooting just come from committing a strong-arm robbery at a convenience store, as was the case in Ferguson?”
not sure why that’s relevant
“If your answers to the above questions are “no”, then perhaps the “Ferguson” controversy is being interjected into a local situation that is not applicable.”
wrong. the local situation and anguish was in part based on the reaction to what happened in ferguson. you don’t need exact same circumstances for it to apply. the question you should ask is whether people would have hit the street absent ferguson? would they have used the signs they did denoting arms up? my answer is no.
“Ferguson” in unraveling as we speak, and if reports are true, maybe we should look at the racial animosity and lynch mob mentality white police officers take.
St. Louis crime reporter: Christine Byers @ChristineDByers
“Police sources tell me more than a dozen witnesses have corroborated cop’s version of events in shooting #Ferguson”
Second, reports out of St. Louis say that the officer in this confrontation had his eye orbital socket broken by Michael Brown when he was attacked by the victim.
Third, this is not a Federal case, yet the President of the United States and Attorney General are weighing in.
Lastly, President Obama, in his TV news conference, never asked for the citizens of St. Louis to stay inside, to not riot. Its as if he enjoys this in some twisted way.
key portion of that: “police sources” – if there were really a dozen witnesses corroborating the police version of events, i suspect we would have heard more about this sooner. to me this reads like spin.
“Second, reports out of St. Louis say that the officer in this confrontation had his eye orbital socket broken by Michael Brown when he was attacked by the victim.”
again skeptical about those reports.
“Third, this is not a Federal case, yet the President of the United States and Attorney General are weighing in.”
a complaint about racial profiling has a civil rights component, which puts it in the federal realm. but realistically, the ag/ president weigh in a lot on local issues that reach the national stage. that’s not unusual.
“Lastly, President Obama, in his TV news conference, never asked for the citizens of St. Louis to stay inside, to not riot. Its as if he enjoys this in some twisted way.”
and if he did, they would listen?
Did you see the video and audio tape – on site, real time – where bystanders (witnesses) described the same occurrence of events? Their description parallels the description given by the police… that Brown ran away, and then doubled back and ran at the officer.
Racial profiling? According to the unpublished police report, these two suspects were walking down the middle of the street, the cop asked them to move to the sidewalk, and they ignored him. He then was told they might be the suspects in the gas station robbery. When he then moved back towards the pair, they slammed his door on him (the officer), Brown hit him in the face and tried to take his gun, and then ran away before coming back to charge the officer. I don’t see any profiling here. (If a police officer asks me to do something, I do it.)
Obama is our first black president who got 98% of the black vote, and had record turnout in the black community. You’re telling me if he asks for peace, implores youth to seek peaceful redress, asks pastors to step in, asks elders to calm down the nerves of younger people, it would have no effect?
Actions like this lead some on the extreme to think Obama & Co. are glad this hit the news, because he was having a horrible month and horrible summer on a number of fronts.
I don’t believe any officers on the Woodland police force were born in the Caucasus Mountains, though it is possible a few hail from the Carpathian range.
:eyeroll: :eyeroll:
it would have been more interesting if matt rexroad had told us when police departments are going to start having counselor’s attend these calls. it’s hard to know if that would have made a difference, but there is a lot that we don’t know just yet.
public officials should be trying to calm people down, particularly since this is the second fatality in woodland in a short period of time. even if the officers were justified, it’s a traumatic experience for all involved.
Maybe the officers did try to calm the suspect down.
if you’re not trained on how to do that, it’s worthless. i’m fairly sure that woodland is not one of the agency with the extra batch of mental health training. davis is.
The question that comes up in my mind when I come across these shootings is how would the individual officers respond if the person that they are dealing with was a family member or someone they know well like a neighbor. Would that change the way they drive to the scene and how they exit the car and every little step along the way?
That is a bit silly unless your point is that the offers should except any and all variables of their personal risk and respond exactly the same to each person they encounter.
Of course if you know someone you will be more able to assess the true risk. Otherwise you can only use your training and intuition.
Frankly
“Otherwise you can only use your training and intuition.”
Agreed. And this of course brings up the issue of the adequacy of their training in the area of dealing with individuals who may be mentally ill . If the training of the correctional offices ins tide our prison system is any indication, or if the point of view presented at Citizens Academy is any indication, then I would say that this area of training is woefully lacking.
What is “silly” about approaching every encounter as if that person was someone who matters in the same way your own mother, brother or good friend matters? It is obvious that the training required to deal with a person who is acting irrationally is very different than the training for someone who has criminal intent but who is otherwise sane in the way most of us would think of what being sane is. If your training is limited to “I’m afraid, so I’ll just shoot first and ask questions later”, then that is unacceptable. It appears that using overwhelming force as a first resort when angrily shouted commands don’t work is the extent of training in too many cities.
Dave Hart’s perspective is wonderful. Too bad law enforcement doesn’t remember that they’re shooting and killing real people with families and loved ones. Of course, they do take care of their own.
It used to be “drop guns”, now it’s knifes, to justify wanton killing by law enforcement.
The “shoot to kill” training of law enforcement is so silly, it’s amazing it hasn’t been changed yet. Although it does have one advantage, it eliminates the main witness to police brutality.
Except that Dave Hart never gets an answer from anyone in law enforcement. I’m not asking the question rhetorically. I really would like to hear law enforcement officers reflect on this question and answer it as honestly as they can. This isn’t the first time I’ve asked this on the Vanguard blog but so far, no takers…
General Eric Holder and President Barack Obama taken a stance questioning the police yet? Will the Sacramento media convict these police officers before the facts are out?
Edit: Have Attorney General Eric Holder and President Barack Obama taken a stance questioning the police yet? Will the Sacramento media convict these police officers before the facts are out?
i don’t think the sacramento media really cares about this, nor does holder and obama. give us some riots, and that could all change.
All police officers in CA are trained in how to deal with people with mental health problems. The course is called CIT and is mandated by POST. I understand the need for the grant funded mental health workers to attend calls with police officers and it will help greatly. But I can guarantee that calls such as the one in Woodland yesterday of an armed person at 5 am, these unarmed civilian people will be no where near the call, nor should they be put in harms way. We do not even know if this call was dispatched as a person with mental health issues. Even this report does not mention mental health, just that Woodland Officers were dispatched to a call of a man causing a disturbance.
So, what we have is a man acting erratically wielding a knife and charging at a Police Officer. I dare any of you to stand your ground and negotiate with a person running at you with a knife. “Please sir stop stabbing me and let me escort you to the hospital”. And as far as Tasers go, they are not deemed non-lethal, the term is less lethal. And they are horribly ineffective in a life or death situation…such as this one. The Officer would have to rely on BOTH Taser probes making contact with the suspects skin and him not being so high that it is effective on him. Usually about 50/50 chance of working. Are any of you willing to take a 50/50 chance of being mamed or killed to save the life of someone charging at you with a knife?
Lastly, Police Officers are not trained to shoot to wound or disarm. They do not shoot the weapon out of the suspect’s hand like an old 60’s western. They could miss and be injured or killed. They could miss and mistakenly shoot an innocent person in the background. They are trained to shoot, in the protection of their life or the public’s, until the threat is gone. That’s it.
I am sorry this man’s life had to end because of whatever issues he was having. But I am happy that Officer is safe and went home to his family. But this isn’t a game or TV show, it’s daily life or death and split second decisions others have the luxury and sitting on and thinking how they’d do it.
TOS
In fact, just because the state mandates training doesn’t mean trainees attend the classes. Some POST academies allow trainees to leave after a few minutes to hit the firing range or the driving track, because that’s more fun.
I’m sooo tired of hearing how dangerous police work is. I used to go out in emergencies to see people who had their loaded gun ready for action, in their hand or their lap. I had no bullet proof vest or communication devices, I just had compassion, sat down next to them, talked them down, however long it took, and drove them to the 5150 unit.
I do know that officers are TRAINED to believe they might be shot and killed at any moment. That’s not a good lens with which to view every situation.
tj wrote:
> just had compassion, sat down next to them, talked them down,
> however long it took, and drove them to the 5150 unit.
OJ’s wife tried to “talk to him” and get him to “drop the knife” but she never got to “drive him to the 5150 unit”…
Officers have wives and families too that they hope to see every night after their shift.
Barack, I misread the last word of your post, accidentally omitting the f in shift. It reads differently that way. My bad.
South of Davis,
OJ was found innocent in the criminal trial. I know from LAPD detectives that the case against OJ was bogus, but Marcia Clark liked the idea of being in the spotlight, and made the most of it at the time and subsequently.
“O.J.’s wife tried to talk to him and get him to drop the knife” has no basis in fact – that wasn’t even claimed by the DA.
Boy, you know a lot. Next you’ll be telling us pigs can fly.
I love this new thing of if you say it, it must be true. So let’s do some training:
“In fact, just because the state mandates training doesn’t mean trainees attend the classes. Some POST academies allow trainees to leave after a few minutes to hit the firing range or the driving track, because that’s more fun.”
POST mandated training requires a roster and 80% attendance of the course. Most have a test at the end of the course and then a training certificate is issued. Again, maybe on TV or in a movie but not real life.
“I do know that officers are TRAINED to believe they might be shot and killed at any moment. That’s not a good lens with which to view every situation.”
This one is correct, because it is true. Two years ago a San Diego Police Officer pulled up to a red light in his patrol car. He was not going to a call or about to make a stop. The person parked next to him at the light shot the Officer in the face with a shotgun. Unbeknownst to the officer the car he parked next to had just been involved in a high speed chase with another agency, no one knows why this guy shot the Officer. So yes, that lens is absolutely necessary.
TOS
Not that it will change several opinions cast in reinforced concrete, but everything said the above post is categorically false!
So what you’re suggesting is that in the cases where they really need the mental health expertise, they won’t have it?
Unfortunately, yes probably most of the time. Fortunately most mental health calls are low key and do not involve weapons.
theotherside
I also am very happy that the officer went home to be with his family. But I am very sad that the victim of the shooting will never again be available for his loved ones.
Your post ignores one very importannt point. Becoming a police officer is not mandatory. It is something that people apply for, train for, and engage in knowing that there are dangers. In this situation, I think that there is far too little information for any one to make any proclamation on either side. We simply do not know if the officer had any other options. So why would any one be making judgements about whether or not this was justified until there is an investigation. This goes both ways. Those who blame the officer are no more correct or incorrect than those who would exonerate without evidence.
Interesting. You point out that my post is making judgements and I feel because it is leaning toward explaining why this shooting might be justified. None of the anti-law enforcement posts are singled out as judgemental. Very interesting.
And yes becoming a Police Officer is not mandatory. And yes it is highly dangerous. So what is the point? Their lives mean less then? I would hate to think that was the point. A knife or gun in the hand of a mentally ill person is just as deadly as in the hand of a person of perfectly sound mind. The bullet travels just as fast and the blade cuts just as deep.
I support officers, and think most of the shootings are justified.
But there were two cases in the Bay Area the past 5 or 10 years that do bother me. In one, a woman was killed because she supposedly lunged at an officer with a pear knife. There were 3-4 officers at the scene, and she was in her 40s or 50s. Sorry, I wouldn’t call that a life-threatening situation. (A 25 year old man with a larger knife, sure.)
At a second scene near Metreon theaters in downtown San Francisco, a clearly disturbed mental case again supposedly lunged at a police officer with a knife. There were multiple police officers on site, and the scene was controlled (per bystanders). He was also killed.
I can contrast this with the real world with someone who had knife training.
I met a man in his early 70s who was a former Marine, maybe 6’3″ and still in decent shape. A young hoodlum in Berkeley called his wife a truly vulgar name, and when he was ready to teach the young punk some lessons (he said he took off his glasses, and handed his wallet to his wife), the man pulled a knife. This punk was maybe 30, 35, and this potential victim is in his 70s. I had no idea what I would do. This older man then took off his belt, put the leather portion wrapped around his hand, and had the buckle dangling down at ground level. He then told the punk: “I’m going to do a lot more damage with this, than you will with that little thing.” The hoodlum knew he had crossed the wrong person, and he ran off. His wife confirmed the details.
He said that he learned how to defend himself against someone with a knife in the Marines.
So it sounds that in some cases, tazers are an alternative. Police in some cities use rubber bullets, which cause a lot of pain but aren’t usually lethal. I also have a friend who sold a kind of net system that could be thrown over a suspect to ensnare them.
I’m sorry, if a 50 year old woman lunges at me with a pear knife, I duck. Besides, police were supposed to be in good or excellent shape… but it looks like union protections may have protected some who have become unable to fully do their jobs. (A recent report says that 80% of police are overweight.)
If the facts support the police officer’s story in St. Louis, I can see him fearing for his life.
True Blue Devil wrote…
So it sounds that in some cases, tazers are an alternative. Police in some cities use rubber bullets, which cause a lot of pain but aren’t usually lethal. I also have a friend who sold a kind of net system that could be thrown over a suspect to ensnare them.
I’m sorry, if a 50 year old woman lunges at me with a pear knife, I duck. Besides, police were supposed to be in good or excellent shape… but it looks like union protections may have protected some who have become unable to fully do their jobs. (A recent report says that 80% of police are overweight.).
In the time it takes the average officer to recognize a threat, draw his sidearm and fire 2 rounds at center mass, an average subject charging at the officer with a knife or other cutting or stabbing weapon can cover a distance of 21 feet.
Google Tueller Drill you might change you mind about fighting someone with a knife.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wmZj6dYrNzk
Also, the average donut eater has a .85 sec to 1.3 sec draw time. Under stress that draw time could slow to 1.5 sec.
So the Marine in his 70s was an aberration?
No. Just a marine with balls of steel…
Mr. Greenwald’s story says that Ferguson has come to Woodland. However, it looks to me like the Ferguson “protestors” have made their way to a town next to it called Dellwood:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zhBeDdYz7cA
So much for wanting justice. The young people in that community are out of control.
Rich wrote:
> So much for wanting justice. The young people in that community are out of control.
It is not just Ferguson, not a week goes by in America when a mob of blacks does not loot a store (but other than after the LA riots and after Katrina (when we had 24 hour black looting coverage for a couple weeks) this gets very little coverage in the mainstream media (that just recently has run some stories on the “knockout game”, always telling us that it is NOT a hate crime)
If you type Black Flash Mob Loot in to YouTube you get over 500,000 (a Half MILLION videos)
Black Flash Rob will get even more videos (and unless someone decides to crack down on this we will just get more of it)
http://live.huffingtonpost.com/r/segment/how-to-stop-teens/51104efc02a760337800080f
“not a week goes by in America when a mob of blacks does not loot a store”
I lived for a number of years in the almost entirely black ghetto of West Oakland, near McClymond’s HS. There was a lot of crime there. It was the murder capital of Oakland, which meant a lot of back then. In fact, I was a victim of crimes there on a couple of occasions. However, I never saw anything like that Dellwood incident. And I am very sure nothing like that ever took place in Oakland’s black neighborhoods. The real battle back then–late 1980s, early 1990s–was gangs battling each other for turf (to sell drugs) and battling the cops who were charged with winning the unwinnable drug war. I personally witnessed, once, a couple of cops beating up a 12 or 13 year old boy, who (I was subsequently told) was a lookout for the drug dealers on my street.
Rich wrote:
> I never saw anything like that Dellwood incident
I first heard about the “flash rob” trend from a friend in FL and (thankfully for us on the west coast) is seems to be (mostly) a “southern thing”…
Rich, times have changed. I’ve seen one or two of these videos linked from the DrudgeReport, but without that source, I would be ignorant of the practice.
Rich, while you saw a young person beaten up by cops, I have witnessed and heard from numerous black friends how they have talked back, challenged, or given lip to police officers, escalating routine traffic stops for apparently no reason.
I was also one mile from where an Oakland police officer was ambushed during a routine traffic stop with two young black males. This was just a few years ago. His colleagues broke protocol, went to pursue the suspects, and another police officer was gunned down shortly thereafter. Two police officers killed within an hour after a routine traffic stop.
TBD
“while you saw a young person beaten up by cops, I have witnessed and heard from numerous black friends how they have talked back, challenged, or given lip to police officers, escalating routine traffic stops for apparently no reason.”
Surely you are not equating a kid being beaten by armed police, with citizens giving “lip” to a police officer for apparently “no reason”.
The police in our society are given privilege to use force at their own discretion. Private citizens are not. They are given training, presumably on how to diffuse increasingly tense situations. Their mission is to defend and protect, not to harass and badger. I offer for your consideration a quote from a LA police officer:
“Even though it might sound harsh and impolitic, here is the bottom line: if you don’t want to get shot, tased, pepper-sprayed, struck with a baton or thrown to the ground, just do what I tell you. Don’t argue with me, don’t call me names, don’t tell me that I can’t stop you, don’t say I’m a racist pig, don’t threaten that you’ll sue me and take away my badge. Don’t scream at me that you pay my salary, and don’t even think of aggressively walking towards me. Most field stops are complete in minutes. How difficult is it to cooperate for that long?”
This to me does not sound like the attitude that I would hope to see from community police. I would counter, how difficult is it to remain professional in the face of rude behavior for that long ?
Tia, a friend from a fire department once let me in on a police officer’s view. There is the ‘driving / law enforcement’ test; and there is the ‘personality test’.
If a citizen doesn’t show respect and work with an officer when questioned, it can make the citizen’s stop tougher. That’s just life, a combative citizen could pull a gun on an officer.
“… SB 82, the Mental Health Wellness Act of 2013, and fund services that would lead to clinical staff accompanying law enforcement responding to mental health crises in Yolo County.”
Having trained clinical staff that can help diffuse situations nonviolently will only help curtail these shootings if police training is also changed. Police officers are taught to shoot to kill if they feel anyone is in danger. I am concerned that means the officer may decide the clinically trained staff member’s life is in danger even if they don’t feel that way.
Themis wrote: I am concerned that means the officer may decide the clinically trained staff member’s life is in danger even if they don’t feel that way.
This is true but what if the police officer decides not to shoot and that clinically trained staff member receives bullet???
John Oliver on Ferguson:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KUdHIatS36A
If a knife wilding person charges at me I will defend myself with any and every deadly force at my disposal. All the facts are not in yet but the Woodland police officer acted in self defense to save his life. I do not understand what in Gods earth they are protesting. For 33 years I work as an Alcohol, Drug and Mental Health clinician with many hours as a crisis clinician and I have the highest respect and regards for the Woodland police department. They always responded quickly and very professionally. Also I watched the present police chief rise through the ranks and he is an extremely ethical and honest person and will makes sure all his employees act according to their rules, I have confidence there is going to be a fair and honest investigation!. Sincerely Carlos G Matos
Thank you Carlos, coming from someone who has had a lot of contact with the Woodland Police Dept. giving an informed opinion on how professional he thinks the WPD is.
I have a family member getting out of prison within a month or so… He is deranged and dangerous! I know for a fact I am going to need WPD assistance very soon! He is PISSED off about going in and blames my family for sending him there even though he was convicted of resisting arrest and felon in possession of a firearm….
Carlos G Matos
I truly appreciate your perspective given the long period of time in which you have had the opportunity to observe the actions of the Woodland police.
I have a much less extensive ( only six evenings) but different perspective on how police officers and other officers of the court primarily from Woodland and Davis chose to represent themselves at a recent citizens academy.
Evening after evening the phrase, “the good guys” vs “the bad guys” was used over and over. Now some may have interpreted this as merely a short hand for the justice system vs the criminals, however, I saw it very differently. I saw this as a mindset with which all ( police, lawyers, judges) view the legal system. If new officers are trained with a mind set that pits them “against the bad guys” instead of seeing their role as protectors of the innocent ( which we are all presumed to be until proven guilty…..right ?) then I cannot see how this provides an adequate atmosphere for sending out individuals who are thoughtful, non provocative, non confrontational to protect our communities.
This is of course a very limited perspective and I am genuinely interested to hear your thoughts regarding this particular representation made by the police themselves.
Correct me if I’m wrong, wasn’t there multiple officers on sight? If the answer is yes, well thenn why do most of you folks only talk about one officer, the one that discharged his fireararm correct? If the answer is again yes, well then can anybody tell me what the hell were the other officers doing!? Just wanted to point that out since I see most of you people’s focus seems to be on one officer.